Snowmelting systems for concrete slabs the concrete network. Porcelain tiles underfloor heating issues diy doctor uk. The best method is installing the underfloor heating into 50mm overlay concrete with insulation between the overlay and the slab. Cracks form especially because the excess water evaporates from the surface at a faster pace than it is replaced by the residual water trapped in the concrete slab or at stress points such as doorways and corners.
In houses not occupied during the day, underfloor heating s slow warmup and cooling time which can be. This article explains how to avoid some fatal mistakes when installing radiant heat in a concrete floor slab by describing an incompetent radiant heat floor installation along with an explanation of why things went wrong and how to avoid these errors. Electric ufh wrong type of self leveling compound and. Underfloor heating and screeding the riba zone flowcrete uk. Underfloor heating ufh is a form of heating in which the floor surface of a space is heated and this heat is then radiated and convected throughout the space to create comfortable thermal conditions. Flexible grout for underfloor heating underfloor heating. Whilst im doing this i think it might be justifiable for me to get underfloor heating done too as the radiators are rubbish. The system is about four years old and recently i have noticed a regular clicking sound from the relay in the controller unit. When installed in a concrete slab, radiant underfloor heating is very efficient and comfortable. A retrofit underfloor heating system answering all of the challenges. Ok sometimes people use wet heat vs dry heat to compare systems using water, aka hydronics or without water, aka forced air or electric but in this case they are referring to the absence of moisture. Radiant heating system design or installation mistakes that must be avoided. The main problem is the cost of underfloor heating. However, while the design and operating principles are well known to building services engineers, the finer points of design and installation may not be known by other specialists such as structural engineers, concrete contractors, installers and facilities managers.
The underfloor heating was then switched on at a low heat to dry the screed. For 30 to 40 percent of underfloor heating systems, people opt for a separate room control, or in other words, the ability to set the temperature in different rooms. Why are my porcelain floor tiles over underfloor heating. When advising on retrofit underfloor heating systems, there is a continual tradeoff of parameters on the one hand, there is a requirement to keep the system as slim as possible to minimise loss of floortoceiling height. Snowmelting systems for concrete slabs learn about heated driveways and how electric and hydronic heating systems can turn your exterior concrete flatwork into a radiant heat source, eliminating ice buildup and the need for harmful deicing chemicals by anne balogh, concretenetwork. In older buildings creating the right conditions under the floor can take time and cause major upheaval. Fourth, a foundation problem can cause tiles to either pop at the grout lines or to form cracks in the tile surface. Tiling onto cracked screed addressing underlying causes of tile. Tiling onto cracked screed addressing underlying causes. The problem is that the tiles have been fixed direct to the screed there should have been a uncoupling membrane such as schluter ditra uncoupling mat laid before tiling, which takes up the movement as the floor expands,there is only one solution and that is to remove the. Avoidance mitigation of the effects of common forms of cracking. You dont have to worry about what the coverage over the pipes is, even if you do get any induced cracking it is not a major problem at all.
The misuse of underfloor heating with sudden temperature changes is the biggest reason for cracks in floors. Several contractors we supply have placed infloor heating in garage or basement floors. Two crack inducing products available are crackmate and canzac. Installing underfloor heating with solid floors when we go out to do our green deal assessments, we encounter some interesting properties on our travels. The adhesive it self doesnt really need to be flexible in the true sense s1 class to be ok with underfloor heating, a lot of the cheaper brands that call themselves flexible c2 class can actually be used with underfloor heating and show no problems even though they shouldnt call themselves flexible recent court cases mapei vs ardex. The problem is that its an extension to an existing solid floor room. From looking at these photographs i would say this is an inferior underfloor heating system as regards the control setup. Everything works fine, but a year after installation, some of the grout in the kitchen was cracking between some of the tiles across various areas.
Installing underfloor heating into an existing floor. This method is slowly coming in nz and already done for decades in europe. Screeds with underfloor heating 1 underfloor heating is an established technology. Since the concrete slab installation is fairly simple, many people fail to follow some simple yet very important steps thinking that it will work no matter what. There are a lot of other terms and descriptions commonly used for floor heating concepts including in floor heating, infloor heating, underfloor heating, slab heating, inslab heating, tile heating and undertile heating. Where cost is an issue, the expense of installing underfloor heating may outweigh the advantages, especially if it involves removing concrete floors and rescreeding. Underfloor heating and engineered wood floor problem diynot. As part of a new extension and house refurb, i had a new concrete sub floor laid in september last year.
Concrete certainly isnt the only type of flooring that reacts this way, so we would always recommend taking professional advice when considering any type of underfloor heating installation, but especially so when working with concrete. Fitting wood flooring over underfloor heating woodpecker. Resin, polished concrete floors and underfloor heating technical document. Any cracks in the subfloor must be repaired to stop them showing through and cracking the bonded screed. Does polished concrete floor work with underfloor heating. When commission underfloor heating in a screed, there will be thermal movement. They have an open concept floor plan and have the radiant heat in the family room and kitchen area that is open to their second story. One property we recently green deal assessed, located in london, was going through a major refurbishment, including the installation of underfloor heating. Tiling onto cracked screed addressing underlying causes of. If you dont take the proper precautions, frost can form in the subgrade soils resulting in raised, cracked floors and a host of potential problems, including.
How to prevent and repair frost heave under your freezer floor. All of our poured resin or polished concrete flooring is suitable for any type of ufh. Installing pex tubing for concrete slab underfloor heating is one of the easiest ways to install radiant heat. First, you cut slots into the floor with our specially developed underfloor heating milling machine. Apr 15, 2017 while infloor radiant heating systems have a fair list of advantages, it has a set of disadvantages as well. The day prior to installation apply one coat of a good quality bonding to the subfloor agent and allow to dry overnight. If issues arise at any point with the heating system, the problem urgently needs to be. Had exactly this, although without the underfloor heating. Mistakes to avoid when installing radiant heat in a. The fitter is now saying that he thinks this isnt the cause and that it could be shrinkage due to the underfloor heating.
When cemfloor is being used with underfloor heating remove all debris from the subfloor and make sure the floor insulation sheets are fitted properly with no gaps between sheets to avoid thermal bridging to the subfloor. Tiled floors with underfloor heating designing buildings wiki. Accommodating radiant heat in slabs concrete construction. It works just fine, except that they keep their house at 65 degrees on purpose. In this form of application the screed is laid directly onto unprepared concrete and it cannot be guaranteed to achieve a bond across 100% of the area. To counter this an appropriate decoupling membrane can be used. There are a lot of factors to take into account during both the design and installation phases. Common problems with infloor radiant heating systems. The biscuit screed will be covered with the floor boards, and thus protecting the screed. I have undefloor heating in the 2 12 year old kitchen and office extension using polypipe, 70mm screed on top, and have 45 x 91cm porcelain tiles in the kitchen. Radiant floor heating how to heat concrete floors the.
The terms radiant heating and radiant cooling are commonly used to describe this approach because radiation is responsible for a significant portion of the resulting thermal comfort but this usage is technically correct. We used the back door, into the area, took shoes off, and carried on into the rest of the house. What could cause a clicking sound in an underfloor heating. There are a number of layouts for underfloor heating especially with so many companies manufacturing the equipment and not nearly enough plumbers who know what they are doing when it comes to underfloor heating in my opinion. Problems with tiles cracking with underfloor heating. If the slab is too green, you could get edge curl from uneven drying and cracking because of uneven heating causing shrinkage cracking.
Site preparation for cemfloor with underfloor heating. Underfloor heating can cause an array of issues if not tiled onto correctly, from cracking due to heat expansion to damaging wires with a trowel. We gave up after a couple of repairs and laid highquality vinyl over the floor tiles we had just enough room. Both of these concrete floor heating systems will raise the height of your floor and might cause problems with doors. The tiles are laid on an underfloor heating system, and the cracks have appeared along the threshold of a door that meets carpet on the other side.
However on concrete floors the more insulation you put in, the more room height you sacrifice, although obviously the less heat will escape into the ground. Issues experienced include uneven dissipation of heat in the ufh system, cracking or collapse of screeds, cracking of floor tiles and grout and uneven floors. However, cracking, associated with underfloor heating is a common cause of problems in rigid tiled flooring. Im either going to have to skim the floors or at worst have them totally redone. However, the single biggest problem is a lack of understanding regarding the impact this type of heating has on screeds, and how those screeds react to. Underfloor heating designing buildings wiki share your construction industry knowledge.
If the stress relief joints are not in the correct place, or perhaps not used at all, the screed may crack. The placement of movement or expansion joints, necessary to mitigate cracking in the screed, are thought out at the design stage, by carefully considering both the screed and underfloor heating. This would seem not to be the case based on the current popularity of underfloor heating all over the world. With good working practice along with careful use of shrink reducing admixtures, designed reinforcement and crack control joints the risk of cracking is reduced. How to tile over underfloor heating systems ambiente. My question is about tolerance of pex infloor piping to cracking and slight movement of the basement floor slab. I had underfloor heating installed on top of rigid insulation boards and then a floor screed poured at the end of october. There are two solutions for this problem, one for each electric underfloor heating and piped underfloor heating. Each room has a uponor t37 thermostat, hooked up to c35 controller. Stone and ceramic tile finishes are at risk of developing cracks from screeds drying out or as the underfloor heating pipes expand and contract.
Generally, hairline cracks in the concrete will not present an issue to the tile floor above. Traditionally screeds are sand and cement mixtures, blended. Flexible grout for underfloor heating will solve all these. You can tell where it hasnt bonded by tapping the dried screed and listening for a hollow sound, meaning it has not bonded. Underfloor heating for resin flooring, polished concrete and. Floor heating faqs inslab undertile frequently asked. Doesnt the ply expand due to the heating and wont that crack the tile adhesive. Choose from a variety of heat sources theyre hydronic, heating a home by radiating heat from warm water piped through a closed loop under floor network of tubing. When ufh is used, water evaporates at a more rapid pace, increasing the risk of cracking.
Top 10 best radiant floor heating systems consumeraffairs. Its not necessarily a question of the screed cracking, and the. Now he told me that he cant screed it because of the beamsjoists and instead he will ply over, which he thinks will not be a problem for tiling. It is vital that you dont run the underfloor heating coils directly onto the concrete floor without first laying insulation otherwise the majority of the heat will be lost into the ground. Ultra tile adhesives flexjoint is specially designed for areas where movement or vibration is likely to cause problems with grout or tiles cracking and is perfect for underfloor heating where the constant heating and cooling and expansion and contraction can cause similar problems. Thats why stefan lenting, product specialist for ubel dutch technical wholesaler, is sharing his top 5 dos and donts for a hasslefree installation. May 12, 2018 the scenario is i can see the builders arguing that these cracks are normal and theyve done this before without any problems at other properties. How to prevent your tile floor from cracking warmlyyours.
Ceramic tiles laid on top of underfloor heating pipes or cables also need flexible tile adhesive and grout, and soft joints around the edges of the room all to accommodate the thermal expansion and contraction, as well as the shrinkage and settlement of the concrete floor. Floor heating is a term which covers a wide range of heating applications, systems and products. Installing pex tubing for concrete slab underfloor heating. It has been used for thousands of years as a form of space heating, most notably by the romans. Feb 24, 2008 discuss cracking screedstiles and underfloor heating in the. After the systems completion, you will also want to.
Underfloor heating and flowing screed install youtube. Underfloor heating warms up your floors and makes your whole house warmer. Bre has investigated many cases where stone or ceramic tiles have been laid on screed only for cracks to appear in the tiles and along grouted joints within weeks of the heating system being operated. To avoid problems during future coldweather startups, the slab temperature should be. The best floor coverings for use with surface heating are hard surfaces as they have the least resistance and transfer heat effectively. Ultra tile adhesives flexjoint is specially designed for areas where movement or vibration is likely to cause problems with grout or tiles cracking and is perfect for underfloor heating where the constant heating and cooling and expansion and contraction can cause. Common issues and queries you can face movement due to thermal expansion and contraction. Does anybody have experience of that goes in between the underfloor heating and the tiles.
Underfloor heating options on solid concrete floor. Since the concrete slab installation is fairly simple, many people fail to follow some simple yet very important steps thinking that it. Though concrete freezer floors can last up to more than half a century, the underfloor heating system beneath still requires regular preventive maintenance. As a warranty provider we are seeing an increase in the number of claims which relate to the combination of underfloor heating ufh systems and floor screeds. How can screed cracks and artificial joints be permanently closed. Tubes that circulate hot water or electrical heating elements are installed in the concrete slab when its poured, turning the thermal mass of the concrete into an inconspicuous radiator of warm, even heat. They have a cement floor in their family room where the radiant heat is. Recently i came a cross a basement infloor radiant system, and there was cracking of the concrete slab and some hollow sounding areas of the slab.
A recommended alternative to saw cutting is the use of crack inducers. Just a tiny movement of the joists or plywood can lead to cracking. Fine stress relief cracks are unlikely to present a problem in areas to be. Exposure of screeds and concrete to direct sunlight and or drying winds causes. With the pipes in the slab replacement is pretty much impossible.
Aug, 2015 though concrete freezer floors can last up to more than half a century, the underfloor heating system beneath still requires regular preventive maintenance. If the temperature of your water heating system is turned up too quickly this could cause shock, leading to cracking. If cracks appear it is therefore important to work out the cause before repairing them, as if the screed failure is being caused by the underfloor heating then just fixing the cracks compacted properly around the underfloor will not solve the problem. Flooring above the underfloor heating will expand and contract more than the flooring that isnt, but the joint will accommodate for this movement. Installing underfloor heating into an existing floor can be done in just two days. Have just encountered a problem with a row of cut travatine marble tiles cracking at a door threshold. The workers in the photograph at page top, where our concrete slab.
Clearing the air on radiant see our comprehensive list of research citations on radiant cooling and heating. The contractor applied a layer of traditional cementsand screed to a. Lightweight concrete floor structures must be fitted with a vapour barrier because of the long dryingout time. Underfloor heating for resin flooring, polished concrete. Problems with underfloor heating screwfix community forum. How to avoid screed failure barbour product search. Why are my porcelain floor tiles over underfloor heating lifting. Sep 28, 2016 obviously the fitter is not very keen to rip up the floor as it is likely this will damage the underfloor heating and result in the whole floor and electrics needing to be replaced. If this is a requirement, then apply an electrical control system, which lets you open and close separate groups.
Jul 15, 2014 even without the underfloor heating, tiling on top of a recentlyscreeded concrete floor requires an uncoupling membrane. Perfect for wooden and concrete subfloors and with the lowest price online. We installed all of the underfloor heating and flowing screed to these two houses in just one day. Lazenby concrete installations frequently asked questions. Underfloor heating and cooling is a form of central heating and cooling which achieves indoor climate control for thermal comfort using conduction, radiation and convection. The science behind radiant floor heating is quite simple.
Everything works fine, but a year after installation, some of the grout in the kitchen was cracking between some of. I have a underfloor heating system installed in my apartment. Tiling with underfloor heating or under tile warming. How to prevent your tile floor from cracking written by stephanie cernivec. Due to thermal expansion and contraction, natural timbers are prone to cracking when used over underfloor heating installations. If only part of the subfloor has underfloor heating, separate the wood flooring above the heated and unheated areas using a dilation joint. Laminate, engineered wood and timber floor coverings can be fitted with underfloor heating. Floor screeds and underfloor heating a bestpractice guide. Should an option be to ask the underfloor heating to be turned on gradually and see if any problems arise. A typical boiler will heat water to about 82 degrees which is much too hot for pipes in an underfloor heating system. Installing underfloor heating with solid floors thegreenage. Mistakes to avoid when installing radiant heat in a concrete.
Two of these floors have cracked after turning on the heat. Our surface heating and cooling systems are compatible with virtually all types of floor covering. This article has been produced after extensive research and more importantly our own experience in fitting poured resin or polished concrete flooring over underfloor heating ufh. One of the problems is the concrete floor in the living room is cracking has craters in part of it. Did you find that using a patch of ditra as you described solved this problem. Underfloor heating options on solid concrete floor page. If the rh in the substrate is over 90%, a plastic sheeting vapour. The tile cracks and open joints are almost always caused by movement of the.
520 891 563 607 232 74 229 1386 732 1415 1445 104 308 671 1366 349 108 1041 595 156 736 1366 1165 62 1 182 853 232 586 1486 1237 417 1416 1136 1170 643 804 779 24 225 598 789 880 685 1043